Workplace Rights & Career Moves in the Menopause Part 2

Part 2 has arrived!  The conversation continues with Amanda Connolly  who has over 25 years experience in HR and also a career coach.   We are talking all things from workplace rights to changing your career during midlife.   You will learn all about work culture and what your company should have in place, what law is changing this year and also some tips to help. 

Today is question time from an audience member and the wonderful Carol makes a return to ask all things work place related during the Menopause.  

Of course it wouldn't be menopause dinners without food.  Today's meal was a vegetarian lasagne, recipe available on You Tube!  Both Amanda and Carol scored the meal, they loved it!!  

We also cover why some women change jobs during midlife, is it due to Menopause?  Are they fed up with their current job or is it something else.  All will be revealed.

Part one and two were both fun and educational, some laughs thrown in there two.  I really hope you found them useful.

Please get in touch if you would like to be on the podcast, either as a guest or in the audience.  There is absolutely no experience needed, no professional talking, I am looking for the average female who is going through their menopause and would like to talk openly about it.  If this sounds like you or you would like to be around other women to feel supported, then please get in touch through any of the details below.  This can be online, in person or at IG6 3HD

Email - ⁠⁠menopausedinners@gmail.com⁠⁠

Website: https://www.menopausedinners.co.uk

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Facebook / You Tube - Menopause Dinners

Sponsored by: Fitness Therapy 4 you: ⁠⁠https://www.fitnesstherapy4you.co.uk⁠⁠

Instagram/Facebook & You Tube: fitnesstherapy4you

You Tube channel where you can learn about the Menopause: ⁠⁠http://www.youtube.com/@fitnesstherapy4you508

Amanda Connelly. 
Website :  https://www.pauseandempower.com/
linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/manda-connolly/
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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:15

Welcome to Menopause Dinners. My name is Sarah, and I'm your host. Not only is it me, but I have some incredible guests with me today. You can expect more stories, laughters, a few tears, and some facts to help you feel not alone in this ship's storm called the Menopause. So sit tight and let's ride this storm together. Welcome to Menopause Dinners. So you really need to listen to part one before part two, but very, very briefly, we're talking about working um as menopause ladies in the workplace, uh, getting some uh expert advice from our guests who I'll reintroduce in a second, and also about why we like to change jobs during our midlife. Is it because we've gone completely nuts? Who knows? Who knows? So um I'm gonna reintroduce the guests to you today. So we've got back with us Amanda and we've got Carol. Carol's not for my so um just a quick reintro. So Amanda has uh worked in HR for 25 years plus, she is a coach. Got that right?

SPEAKER_03 1:56

A career coach for going through today.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

Thank you very much. Nicely, nicely said. So before we carry on with uh part two, as you know, menopause dinners is all about food, and I've got to say, I was really, really impressed. Amanda came all the way. Can I say where you live? Yeah. From Bedford, I mean, oh my god. That's a number of applause.

SPEAKER_03 2:19

You're such Londoners, it's not that far. We mean it's north of London on the train. We mean it's north. North London, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 2:28

North. Um, no, I'm really, really, really, really uh glad that you've come uh here tonight. But also, I thought I can't just do the normal stuff, so I made uh vegetarian lasagna because I did ask for special requirements for you, Dietrich. I wasn't gonna give her like a steak or a pudding. I'm not giving her a pudding. So this vegetarian lasagna uh it's made with chickpeas, it's got um uh big aubergines in it, big peppers, and big peppers in it, um, feta cheese, and I actually did put some um other stuff in there which you can look on the YouTube because you can see me make it and you can see the recipe details as well.

SPEAKER_03 3:13

But probably will do that actually.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

Oh, you can chop up the aubergine though.

SPEAKER_03 3:17

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

So what did you think, Amanda?

SPEAKER_03 3:21

I was very pleasantly surprised. Was you? Yeah, yeah, I really enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Good. So you feel like you've you're you're worth coming down. Worth coming down, Edward. Carol, what did you think?

SPEAKER_00 3:32

I thought it was lovely. I I didn't like the peppers, because I'm not great with peppers, but nobody is.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Oh, for God's sake. It's always something out, Carol. Sardings or peppers. Oh my god. No, that's I thought it was great. Thank you very much. So give me a score out of ten. Nine. Oh go on, Carol. Nine and a half.

SPEAKER_03 4:01

Nine and a half? I didn't know we could give them. Nine and three quarters.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

Thank you, thank you for so much, and I'm glad you enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_03 4:10

I don't believe in perfection, so no one gets a ten. No.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Well, same here. Nine and three-quarters. Same here. I would never give a ten, but thank you. I'm I'm really touched. So yeah, I'm gonna post that. But loads of goodness in there for uh Perry menopause and menopause and posts. So, oh my goodness, we've gotta just go through a few things with Manda before we open up the questions, because we've got some questions. Some people are here, some people aren't, but don't worry about that. Is there anything that we didn't cover in part one?

SPEAKER_03 4:39

Probably quite a lot, but I don't know off the top of my head. Yeah, so let's see the questions. Let's see the questions.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

So, part two is really all about what people can do. This is about empowering people to make those decisions. So I think do you know what? Let's just open up some questions and then we can come back to anything. Carol, have you got any questions for Amanda?

SPEAKER_00 5:04

Um, when I was speaking to Amanda earlier, um, I did say to her that our organisation has got a policy. And then Amanda asked me, did it get rolled out to the managers? And I said no, because I don't think we realised that there was something to do after that. So, um how do we go back to it?

SPEAKER_03 5:29

Okay, so I would say there's five key things you need to look at when you're rolling out a new policy of anything at all. Um, one is that you've engaged a client group that they fed into it. The other is that your managers are trained and understand how to deliver the policy to their teams. I think one of the key things about Perry is that we quite often need flexible working. So making sure your policies are up to date, not just on menopause, but all of the policies that you know, sort of sickness and flexible working, and a nice um non-specific one, but one that's super important, is ensuring that your um your workforce is in a psychologically safe space, which is a bit of a tenuous thing, but I think that's if people basically that's about people being okay to ask questions and not feeling like there's gonna be any retribution. You need to have that if you're gonna have a policy around women when they're feeling a bit flaky, they need to feel safe when they're asking those questions. So that's kind of imperative, and each organization will have different parameters, how they measure that.

SPEAKER_00 6:46

Um I think where we might have stumbled is that the training for managers and um I'm gonna go back and just double check and see how is that we can pick up. I do feel that we have ambassadors that don't know that they are ambassadors because that's very worrying of a first aid and not knowing what plaster is, isn't it really? Because people I I the safe space is there, but we haven't encouraged it or promoted it in any way. So um I think that that kind of box-ticking exercise. Yeah, we've done that, yeah, but we haven't seen it fully through. So I do think that there is a piece of work to be done. So I can go and start the conversation because I'm menopause all and I don't care what I say.

SPEAKER_03 7:42

And do you work for a really large organisation, so you can always start with the protected characteristic of menopause coming in this year. Have you done X, Y, and Z? I think it's a good idea for us to get ahead of the curve as a council.

SPEAKER_00 7:59

Yeah, and um definitely um we will be going back because um there's little bits and pieces, and like you said, now it's going to be brought in as law. Yeah, let's get ahead of the game and let's make sure that we've done everything that we need to do.

SPEAKER_03 8:13

And this stuff isn't tricky, but it just requires some thought to it.

SPEAKER_00 8:16

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

So how should women experiencing menopause bring the topic up with their boss?

SPEAKER_03 8:25

That's a bit like how long is a piece of string, because it depends on your boss. So there are some organisations that direct you to go to HR for these sorts of things, and some that direct you to your manager. If you have a manager that's you believe would be open to you requesting you know reasonable adjustments, but justifying why you need them. So basically saying this is what I'm experiencing, this is what I think will resolve it. Can we try this for six months? If you have a manager that will you think that and you kind of know whether your manager's going to be receptive to not. Yeah, definitely. If they're not receptive, then you need to go to your HR team. If the HR team don't exist, you need to go to your boss's boss, basically. This is like you need to take it up the chain because this is an obligation by the for the organisation to support you in your health and safety, basically.

SPEAKER_01 9:18

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:19

This falls under that at the moment, so they have a requirement to make sure they're looking after you. So it's not nice to say, you know, you are legally obliged to make sure that I'm supported, even though they are. Yeah, yeah. You want to have a conversation that's like, you know, how how can we work this out so we're both winning?

SPEAKER_01 9:36

Is a recommendation to speak with hate HR before your line manager? I mean, I I think I know the answer to that one, but I'll let you answer that.

SPEAKER_03 9:44

Yeah, I think it depends on your organisation, what the policy is, and also bugger what the policy is, if you think that they're receptive, then do it. You know, because at the end of the day, it's your line manager's responsibility to look after you. That that's their job. So I think it's always better because also what you're asking for will impact that line manager, but it won't impact HR. So if you're gonna ask to work from home for a day a week or two days a week, or if you want to, you know, be sat next to a window or encourage, you know, be encouraged to take breaks to go and get some fresh air because you're overheating, that HR don't really care about that, but your manager's gonna be super miffed if they haven't approved it. So having that conversation and being open and honest with your manager, I think, is the best course of action if you can do it.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

Okay, so what about if you are in an organization where there's no HR, it's just maybe a couple of bosses and they're not listening to you. What is the next point of call for someone that's struggling and and that can see that they're not getting the support that they need?

SPEAKER_03 10:54

So if they're not getting the support they need and it's like a five-person business and it's then managers that are sort of making decisions, then I'm afraid I would encourage you to submit a flexible working request, which is a very formal document that requires a very formal reply. And in that you'd be putting in your and I'd I it I would strongly suggest that you get support from either someone you know in HR or a coach or a mentor or whoever it is, some HR person, to give you some support on how to fill that in. So the key thing with a flexible working request is to make sure you're including um review periods. So you could say I want this for two years with reviews every six months, that's a reasonable, and they can't argue with that really. Um and also you're not just asking for things, you're suggesting why it might be beneficial for the business. So sometimes we need to be a bit creative about that, but there is always something you say, well, if you look after me, then this will be the impact.

SPEAKER_01 11:57

Yeah, that's like me when me and my husband first started going out, and I wanted to go to the cinema and see a certain film, I would do it so he would say that that film and then I'd make it his choice. Are you we saying something along those lines?

SPEAKER_03 12:14

If we have the capability of doing that, then absolutely, yes. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 12:19

Yes, I can't do it anymore because he knows that I do it. Damn. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:24

But um, if if you're if you can't get any support by going to your boss and being informal and you know being human, then unfortunately the only way of doing it is to scare them with legislation, which is not ideal, but it shows you're not messing around and you know what you're talking about. If you submit a flexible working request around your menopause symptoms, you reference um disability discrimination, health and safety, um, and also the fact it's becoming a protected characteristic, that will scare them enough, I'm pretty sure, to give you what you want.

SPEAKER_01 12:59

Okay, and let me just ask the the most silliest question: what happens if it doesn't scare them and they're very blase? What's the next step from there?

SPEAKER_03 13:10

Well, this is gets a bit tricky because most I think most of the time, night nine times out of 500, they would realize They'll be like, oh dear. Yeah, yeah, we better do this. What if basically if you're being discriminated against in work um and your company aren't helping you, then you can take them to a true tribunal. Okay. Because they are breaking the law. Now, often you'd need to leave your position and then claim constructive dismissal. That's basically saying that your company has made you resign because they're not dealing with your very reasonable requests. Right. And generally, if your company has just blanked you, they won't have followed any of the proper procedures that you need to do, so you will win the case. So if they're that sort of company, they won't have done anything right.

SPEAKER_01 13:58

What's a reasonable time for them to come back to you to either say yes or no?

SPEAKER_03 14:04

So there is a um an actual requirement for response to a reasonable question, two months. So they absolutely have to have considered it. And because it's a business request and it's it's a format, so you fill in certain things, they cannot reject you without um a business case, basically.

SPEAKER_01 14:24

Right, okay.

SPEAKER_03 14:25

And if you're superseding that with the res this is how it's not going to affect the business, then they'd be really challenging.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

So uh what three goal practice tips would you offer organisations wishing to provide proactive support to women in any stage of the menopause?

SPEAKER_03 14:41

One is to have a policy, two is to have trained managers, and three advocates. I think if you did that with integrity, then they're great steps to get something sort of embedded in a culture.

SPEAKER_01 14:57

And with the training, we've talked about this before in part one. Are there any dodgy training courses out there for for menopause or that or have you do you know money much about them? Are there are there good ones out there? Or not sure?

SPEAKER_03 15:14

Uh so that's really tricky actually, because there are some really good small providers, but they're also very big providers, both good and bad. Right. So I would say with any sort of training that you're getting, make sure you do your due diligence on them, make sure you get feedback from clients, or you know, ideally you want referrals.

SPEAKER_01 15:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:34

So if you're interested in something, if someone asked me, then I'll be able to suggest people in your area.

SPEAKER_01 15:39

Sure.

SPEAKER_03 15:40

Um, but I think it's just a case of you asking what people have experienced. Because actually, I think there's quite a lot of people in bigger organisations that have had menopause training, whether it's been, you know, we've never had it.

SPEAKER_00 15:53

I didn't even know that menopause training was a thing. That's weird. So I think it would be good because I'm a trainer. And so and a learning and development training for the organisation I used to be.

SPEAKER_03 16:06

And a project coordinator.

SPEAKER_00 16:08

And a project. I wear a lot of hats. She's a chef as well.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

You need to you need to cook the next time. Yeah, I can cook, no problem.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

But I think training is uh a really good thing.

SPEAKER_03 16:33

I'm really surprised that if you have a menopause policy, you do not have trained trainers.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

No, we don't.

SPEAKER_03 16:42

Because how how are your staff or managers supposed to know? Is that how you generally roll out training? Here's a document, read it. Is that training to you?

SPEAKER_00 16:51

Well, we kind of do it on the basis of what a manager needs. So, you know, the fact that we've got a menopause policy, it was because it was the buzz. That's why we got the policy going.

SPEAKER_03 17:02

You've probably got it because there's a bunch of middle-aged women going through the menopause as well.

SPEAKER_00 17:07

I think so, definitely. But in terms of the effectiveness now and the impact that it should be having, it shouldn't be a small conversation. It should be a big conversation in the organisation, and and and it isn't. We didn't do anything for menopause week. Awareness week. Because we felt your HR team's pants. Well, it wasn't even HR. What about the women's network?

SPEAKER_03 17:30

You've got a women's network, and then I've never trained in menopause.

SPEAKER_00 17:33

And they didn't think it was we'd we'd done the drive, we got the policy. Well, what do we need to do else?

SPEAKER_03 17:40

Oh, that incites me. Do you know what? I'm part of a women's group, a women's networking group, and um when it was my turn to present my career coaching around change, menopause is one of the things, one of the participants said, haven't we talked about this enough recently? That was what we said.

SPEAKER_00 17:58

That's what they said.

SPEAKER_03 17:59

And you're like, Well, it's obviously not landed, has it? Let's talk about it some more then. Oh, that's that's your if that's your attitude, I mean, as a business, of we're not shame on your women's group. They're not feminists, are they?

SPEAKER_00 18:16

And they would consider themselves to be only of a certain age.

SPEAKER_03 18:21

Don't want to support middle-aged women.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

But I think training is definitely an avenue that we should look at as well. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 18:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:29

And we've got a lot of young women coming into the organisation, and I think they we need to raise awareness.

SPEAKER_03 18:36

So the interesting thing about putting in a menopause policy is it often brings up other things, so endometriosis or you know, sort of when people have those really long periods that are really painful. So it's about hormone health. So hormones are really prevalent when they drop off a cliff when they're when you're our age, yeah, but they also mess with your body at least once a month, several times during the year as well. On top of that, women blokes go through life with a hormonal dip, dip, dip, dip, dip. Ours goes up and down, up and down, and then hits perimenopause and just literally drops off a cliff.

SPEAKER_00 19:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:15

So there's that conversation around actually you can engage all areas of the business if you're talking about hormone health. So is it just a menopause policy you need need? It sounds like to be inclusive, you need a hormone policy, yeah, yeah. Hormone health policy, because we don't want to miss out to the youngsters.

SPEAKER_01 19:32

No, you don't experience difficulties. We've been talking about that a lot, haven't we, over the last few podcasts, especially especially for the guys.

SPEAKER_03 19:42

Yeah, so I was the the manopause.

SPEAKER_01 19:45

Yeah, yeah. The manopause. It's true then. No, it's a really it's a really good point. Um, definitely, because I was talking to someone this morning who's 20 that's just learnt about the menopause, and her words were I did not understand it, I did not, I don't get, didn't get it, and I oh my god. And I thought, you know. Aren't you saints?

SPEAKER_03 20:09

Yes, we are. Look at what we have to put up with up to 10 years. Yeah, yeah, maybe. And it's just it's giving people empathy, isn't it? One, if you're sort of doing the training and you're sharing what this is, you're just making people more empathetic. And how is that a bad thing for any business to have empathy for your colleagues? Yeah, yeah. Of course it costs money.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

Oh, yeah, costs money, but it's important to to create that nice energy, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 20:37

I think it's really important because well-being is such a prevalent issue at the moment and it falls under well-being, and to do box-ticking exercises in well-being is a very bad idea. Okay. Because that will get around that you've got these policies that aren't worth the paper they're written on, and you don't want to be that organisation. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:57

What is a strong um organisation that that obviously we've talked about listening and you know, giving you giving time off if needed, but from your experience, you must have seen one that you thought, my god, they've got it, they've nailed it on the head. Unfortunately not.

SPEAKER_03 21:16

I stopped working in HR about three years ago, and it's only been the last three years, I think, we've been having these conversations. Right. The last organisation I worked for, this was um, just to put some background to it. So I was misdiagnosed when I was Peri, and my doctor put wouldn't put me on HRT, he put me on antidepressants. So as a HR consultant, i.e. someone that was going in and delivering projects and then leaving again, so no one cares about what you like and just want you to do the work. Um, the last contract I went into, I actually implemented a menopause policy. And then they cancelled me because of well, it wasn't just my menopausal symptoms because I had brain fog, I had hot flashes and low level rage. No knife. That's no axe. Yeah, no axe either. That's in the car. So, but I also had no empathy because I was on antidepressants. So ultimately, although I delivered an menopause policy, that was the reason I was terminated, was because of my own menopause, which is the the irony does not fail me on that one. But I can understand as a business your contractors are supposed to come in and deliver, and if they're not doing that, then but that's the whole point, isn't it? Like as a contractor, I don't have the the same rights as a permanent employee. If I was an impermanent employee, that would have been a big issue.

SPEAKER_01 22:35

Oh, that would have been a massive issue. It's such a shame, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 22:39

Yeah. But I've I've heard about good companies. Yeah. Like on on the on Tinternet and you know, on that magic tube thing.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Yeah, my my husband's company is amazing. He's what what they're uh I mean when he told them what what I'm doing, they they're all over it. They're like, this is amazing.

SPEAKER_03 22:59

So it's not you don't get a company that's shit at everything else but great at menopause policies.

SPEAKER_02 23:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:03

These are companies that genuinely care about their staff and understand the benefits of looking after their staff.

SPEAKER_02 23:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:10

If a company, and it's always top-down, if your leaders buy into this, if they understand, they will make sure all of their staff understand. So it's really getting that buy-in at the very top that really makes a difference on whether this is we end up being supported realistically or not.

SPEAKER_01 23:28

No, I I I agree with that. I mean, he's been with he's been with two companies. The the company before, they literally drove him to the ground. And I can tell you, I I think that they would definitely not have a menopause policy. But this one he like finishes at 5 30. They probably don't even have contracts there. This one he like finishes at 5 30, the other one he was finishing at midnight.

SPEAKER_03 23:50

Because they realized that and actually in France they made it illegal to call people in work at after six o'clock. You're not allowed, it's illegal to call anybody on work-related business. And you know, everyone bangs on about or you know, they're always striking. They have the bet some of the best employment law, and they are one of the most productive countries.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

That's I like that. It's just but it should be. As soon as you finish work, unless you're someone that is an alarm technician or something, you need to go.

SPEAKER_03 24:19

But then you know, do you know what I mean? If you and if you're like on shift working or whatever, there is always different ways of dealing with things, but fundamentally, if they're looking after you, they're looking after everybody. You love your job? Yes, I love doing the coaching stuff. What do you love about it? Uh so I think that women come to me when they're at a little bit of a crossroads, a lot of loss, and there's something they want to achieve. And after a couple of one or two conversations, we generally know where we're heading because I'm just sort of reading what they're saying and listening to them. Um, and I love the fact that talking to me allows other people to enjoy their lives more, you know, just by talking to me, they're having epiphanies on what they want in their jobs, what they want in their relationships, what they want to do for fun, you know, sort of what their confidence issues are. And I'm not necessarily sort of telling them what they've got to do, although as a mentor I do guide sometimes in the HR remit, but I'm not sort of advising them generally, that's not what coaching is. So it's just really lovely to work with, and but and because I work with professional women, they're generally women that get stuff done. So when they come to me, they know they want to work, and because there is always work outside of the one-hour session, they get homework basically, because if they want to move forward with their lives, doing an hour every two weeks is not going to do it. Yeah, they have to do work in between. And the women that I've worked with, nine times out of ten, I've absolutely nailed that, and you can see how it's having a massive impact to their happiness. That's amazing, their confidence levels, their relationships. It's all about boundaries and confidence, basically, fundamentally, is what I do. Um, I'm kind of like a cheerleader. Are you? And that's quite nice.

SPEAKER_01 26:01

You've got like an outfit. I've got pom-poms. Have you?

SPEAKER_03 26:04

And an axe.

SPEAKER_01 26:05

And an axe. And a knife.

SPEAKER_00 26:09

Excellent. A knife and an axe. What a great job. I wanted to ask you something, Amanda. You know, um, because when you're going through your menopause, then even before you get going through your menopause, and you're experiencing very heavy menstrual cycles and things like that, and then you start and if that happens to you, and if you're then going through your menopause and everything else, there's a great deal of isolation because we're not good conversationists. We talk about everything else, and we could be sitting in a room with five women all suffering with the same thing, and we don't even know that because we want to have a laugh and a joke, we want to put it behind us. But you just said, in terms of when women come to you and everything else, they get an hour of your time to reflect, look at themselves in the mirror. Yeah. Suppose there are women out there that just can't afford it for whatever reason, what kind of things could they do to kind of start talking to themselves and understanding this podcast? Is one thing to know that there are other women out there like me. Yeah, yeah. So where can I go? What can I do? How can I get this started?

SPEAKER_03 27:24

So I would say, and I actually haven't talked about this yet, but one of the biggest things that I find is super useful is tracking your symptoms, your mood, your sleep. Excellent. Now I use um I don't know if you've heard of Louise Newsom, who's uh massive in the menopause space. She's got an app called Balance, completely free, and I track my sleep because that's the issue for me. But you can also track your symptoms and you know, sort of your moods. So once you've done that for maybe a couple of months, you get an understanding of where you are with stuff. Go out, uh educate yourself. There's podcasts out there like this one that are maybe specific to what you know, maybe your confidence has not been knocked. There's bound to be a podcast about that. So don't look at it just from I've got a it's great for you to be listening to podcasts about the menopause because it's just upskilling us all, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. And we're all feeling a bit more connected. But if you have specific things that you're working towards, so I also use a wheel of life, and you can just pull these off the internet and just sort of fill in, and you can kind of put all your sections around it. It's like a pie split up: work, relationships, self-development, money, home life, family life, whatever it is, choose your bits, and then you mark it one to ten. I've done that. Look at the three lowest ones and focus on them. And there's lots of self-help books, podcasts, movies. I I mean, I do do pro bono coaching if people, you know, sort of need if you're referred through a charity, which you are now as a sick, aren't you? C I C.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

Yeah, we're nonprofit.

SPEAKER_03 29:03

Right, so you could refer somebody to. I mean, they get three sessions. Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

That's good. Okay, can we refer ourselves?

SPEAKER_03 29:10

Yes, we could. Yeah, I think you need to.

unknown 29:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:15

So um, yeah, so there's there's there's avenues of doing things, but I think that I'm a big advocate of HRT because it really did sort me out. Um, I was going absolutely do lally. And now I'm sort of on HRT and supplements because being ADHD, I need supplements, but also some of the symptoms are the same. So sometimes I don't know if it's the ADHD or the menopause, I'm going do lally. But what was I saying? Oh, rain fog. What were we saying there?

SPEAKER_00 29:47

Come on, oh, we were talking about what was the app?

SPEAKER_03 29:52

Because you mentioned balance app balance. You're talking about the wheel of life. Oh, the wheel of life. Yeah, yeah. Um, just basically, yeah, there's there's lots of different things that you can do that don't cost a lot of money. Oh, oh, I'll tell you what also. Yeah, no, I was telling you that um I'm a big advocate of HRT. Yeah, yeah. I was over the phones then. Um so I was I was on HRT and I've also gone on supplements, but I do want to let everybody know if you are someone that's messing around with supplements, you want to do that instead of HRT, if you want to do a mix or whatever, there is a free service from Naked Pharmacy. And I don't know if it's just because I'm ADHD, but I actually sent them a list of everything that I was on with the dosages and the brands and what my symptoms were, and they went through it all and they told me that I could drop some things because they shouldn't be taken with other things, and um basically they did suggest that I buy something from them, but what I was buying from them was half the price of the stuff they told me to dump. And actually, since I've been on their one tablet rather than the three I was taking, definitely, apart from that one wobble there with me, brain fog, which let's be honest, ladies, it's a roller coaster, isn't it? So you're not allowed to.

SPEAKER_01 31:10

So far. Um that's that's interesting. I've not heard of them. I don't know if pharmacy.

SPEAKER_03 31:15

I'm gonna look three, half, but yeah, don't just call them up and say, Oh, I don't want to talk to you about this. Get tell them exactly what you want. I think you've got to be very prescriptive with customer service these days, don't you?

SPEAKER_01 31:26

Yeah, no, that's a really helpful. Yeah, no, I really like that question, Carol.

SPEAKER_00 31:30

I thought it was a really, really good, useful one for And I think that l we need to take ownership. We're going through um a journey, and you can't just sit back and just think.

SPEAKER_03 31:41

That's a wild ride.

SPEAKER_00 31:42

Yeah, and you can't just sit back and think, Well, I hope things change. You've got to do something.

SPEAKER_03 31:48

What's that phrase? Doing the same thing continuously and expecting a different outcome is one sign of madness. I'm sure it's it's a bit sharper than that, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 31:57

But that's I'm just going with the flow. I'm just going with the flow. I think I think you might be right. I think you might be right.

SPEAKER_03 32:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:03

Okay, so let's give someone some advice that let's let's say that someone's struggling with their identity. That's a big one. We talked about that in part one. Not like they don't they wake up and they well, yeah, some people wake up and they just don't know who they are anymore. They lose their identity in the menopause, and when they're working, that can factor into that. What what can we what can we do with that? Is there anything any advice apart from get a coach? Get a coach, funny enough, we've got one here.

SPEAKER_03 32:38

Ba ba ba ba. Yeah, so uh yeah, again, there's lots of podcasts um around sort of that sort of stuff. There's also loads of self-help books. I love a self-help book.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

I'll tell you who I really like, James Clear. Have you ever read James Clear? The best self-help book I've ever read. It's called Atomic Autonomic Habits, and it's about how you change your habit and put a new habit in, and it's so good. Yeah. It's so good.

SPEAKER_03 33:08

I yeah, I think there's loads of good stuff out there, but I think the first thing is being aware of what it is you want to achieve. You know, I don't feel like myself. Well, do you want to be the person you were you were when you were 20? Probably not. But can't you? What do you want to be now and how do you work towards it? Exactly. You get you you uh you upskill yourself basically. You don't have any no, there's no point in looking back because who wants you know, people bang on about school being the best days of your life.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

They went for me, I think. Like shit. Did you? I did. I got I've got that. The shit kicked out of me. Kids are nasty little buggers, aren't they? Oh sorry, they're nasty. They really was. And I'll tell you, if I saw any of them now, trust me, they'd get it. They'd get it. With your meat cleaver. They'd make they more than that, the eyes, I can do it with my eyes. Don't need an axe or a knife, my eyes can just do it. That's it.

SPEAKER_03 34:05

Zap them.

SPEAKER_01 34:05

Um any f any other questions, Carol, before we wrap up?

SPEAKER_00 34:10

Uh no. I think Commander's been brilliant.

SPEAKER_01 34:13

I think it's a really good call. You drive me all the way down from Bedford.

SPEAKER_00 34:17

It's been worth it, and it's been so okay.

SPEAKER_01 34:20

Can we finish on one more thing? If you could say anything to someone that's listening that's um either needing some coaching or some HR advice, is there anything that you would like to say to them on a personal level, maybe?

SPEAKER_03 34:36

Um Well, I think just generally about being a menopausal woman, I'd just like to say that menopause can feel like everything is falling apart, but actually what's happened is it's realigning.

SPEAKER_01 34:48

Oh, that's I should have that at the end. That's I like that. That's really nice.

SPEAKER_03 34:52

I think that it's really important for women to realise that life is a bit of an up and down y thing, and this is a wobble that we have for a very specific period in life. I'm very much looking forward to being superwoman when I come out the other side. That's what I've been told is gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01 35:08

I've heard that too, but uh I mean, I'm like I said, I'm post and I'm still waiting. I'm still waiting for it. But do you but do you know yourself more now? I I'm I'm getting there now. I'm understanding everything's a process though, Seth. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I'm understanding, like, for instance, when I said about the confidence a little back, I I I get it, and it's still a learning curve, but I am, yeah, I would say that I'm I'm more balanced now. That first year of post for me was really hard. Mentally, it was very draining.

SPEAKER_03 35:44

Why was that?

SPEAKER_01 35:44

I think because you in your menopause, it's kind of like I wouldn't say excitement that you're coming out of it and you're going into but you know that that's finished, but you still have some hormone in your body, but when you hit your post, it's like completely flattens you, completely flattens you out, and I think that what I found really hard. I had depression, anxiety, quite hard, to be honest with you. When I look back at it, I should have gone and got some help, but I just I just plodded through it. Because that's what we're used to doing, because that's what we're used to doing, and let's look around, ladies.

SPEAKER_03 36:25

Like the other buggers asking for help.

SPEAKER_01 36:27

Yeah, why aren't we? Yeah, but we don't we're not expected to carry the whole world on our shoulders. I think for me it's very it's also difficult because of the work that I do. Yeah, and sometimes when you're in a work where you're always giving advice, it's actually quite difficult to do it for yourself.

SPEAKER_03 36:46

And I think Well, I think we're all buggers at not being able to say our own advice. I give great advice, but yeah, I'm rubbish at taking it. Well, you know, but that's why you get your friends, that's why you get your friends around you. Yeah, I think that when what's really useful is once you sort of start connecting with people around the menopause, you meet lots of different other people. And if you can find a buddy that holds you accountable for things, and like you're saying, right, okay, so I'm gonna I'm feeling this, I'm gonna go and get a book.

SPEAKER_01 37:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:13

Well, if no one's gonna follow up on that, that book's never gonna be bought. But if you know that your friend's saying, Right, I'm I'm gonna talk to me about that self-help book next time we see each other.

SPEAKER_01 37:21

Well, you could talk if they've not read it, you could say, Well, it was really good.

SPEAKER_03 37:26

That's not very genuine though, is it, Sarah? No, it's not, it's not if you if your friends would believe you, then they're proper friends, are they? I'd know if my friends were bullshitting like that.

SPEAKER_01 37:37

Um, Amanda, before we wrap up, how can people get in contact with you if they want to?

SPEAKER_03 37:43

If they want to, well, first I'd I'd just let everybody know that I do an article on pauseandimpower.com every week that's around basically anything that I think I'd want to read. So there is menopause stuff in there. There's also stuff about being a working woman in midlife and you know, all sorts of stuff. That's free. So you can go on and have a look at all my I've got 130 articles on there now. Have you really? Oh, you little trombone. Yeah, I've got a trumpet. Um I'm on LinkedIn as Amanda Connolly, C-O-N-N-O-L-L-Y. Okay. Um, I'm on as Pausing in Power on Facebook, one of those pages I set up. I still don't really understand how it works.

SPEAKER_01 38:26

And don't forget, we'll put all of this information, it will be on all of our platforms, wherever you're listening to, it'll be on there.

SPEAKER_03 38:33

And Instagram. So yeah, if there's anybody that needs any guidance or signposting, then feel well. I always offer people a 30-minute discovery call, which is just to see if they're actually wanting to co to be coached, yeah, and if we are a good fit, because not everybody gets on with everybody else, and I'm definitely, you know, a certain sort of person. So it's like half an hour of just checking that you're going to be a good fit.

SPEAKER_01 38:56

And that's what we did for the podcast, wasn't it? It was, yeah. Yeah, to make sure you were a good fit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Should should never have let her come on. Yeah, I thought that one myself. Um, Carol, if anyone wants to be a guest, what do they need to do?

SPEAKER_00 39:13

No, you don't have to have any experience. You've just got to be able to talk, have a chat with us and let us know how you're feeling and how what you've gone through and everything else. But if you want to be on this show and you want to take part, please come along. You can see us on menopause dinner at gmail.com. Is Menopause Dinner all one word?

SPEAKER_01 39:34

Yes. All one word.

SPEAKER_00 39:36

Dinners. Menopause dinners with the S at gmail.com. It's very important. Please just come on board and like and share.

SPEAKER_01 39:48

Thank you very much, Carol. Um before we wrap up, I just want to say that I've really thoroughly enjoyed Carol. How fun has this been today? It's been great fun.

SPEAKER_00 39:58

Thank you, Amanda.

SPEAKER_01 39:59

I really want to say from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_03 40:02

Um I hope it's useful. And if anyone just needs like something really basic, like some guidance on the flexible working request, then just drop me a line.

SPEAKER_01 40:11

Thank you. That means a lot. So massive applause for you, Amanda. Thank you so much. And I think this is gonna benefit a lot of women. And if you do have a question that we haven't asked, answered, then please get in touch and we will put it on our socials. How's it?

SPEAKER_02 40:27

That's great.

SPEAKER_01 40:27

Uh, Carol, thank you very much. Oh, it's gonna it's already late. Bedtime is occurring. It's it's calling me. Oh god, she's looking at okay. Remember to like, rate, and subscribe, or join any of our platforms to let us know that we're doing a good job. There is now a monetisation button as we are now non-profit, so every little helps. Before you go, final thought, Manipal sucks. But with friends, it sucks a whole lot less. We will see you next time on Manipal's Dinners. You take care.

SPEAKER_03 41:08

Big, big, big thank you, Sarah and Carol, for inviting me along. I've thoroughly enjoyed myself and I really hope that your um podcast gets out for a lot more people. Thank you. Been quite a giggle. Cheers.

SPEAKER_01 41:21

Thank you very much. Ranopause Dinners is sponsored by Fitness Service. If you would like to thank Rebridge Sports and Ledger for the use of the Virgin Podcast Sessions, information we have on food and supplementations from our only experiences, so please get medical advice if you are suffering from a medical condition.